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M3 going up for auction???

52K views 378 replies 105 participants last post by  rallyretro 
#1 ·
See rallycarsforsale.net

Anyone know if this is true or has someone got their facts mixed up?

Would be a shame to see this car leave Ireland.
 
#166 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Hello everybody,
Why it s so difficult to see the papers or Matter plate for Cronin car ?
As everybody known Cronin car have been damage badly a fews times, may be he have been reshell, I don t known but would like to see some good photos of it.
The plate GXI 9427 is a BMW 316 from 1985 and when you have a BMW M3 built in 1988, I don t think that you can do that.

I m sure that most of you are intelligent but nobody answer the question of how it s possible that a car built in 1988 was rallied in 1987. Now you can continue to
claim funny things but intelligent people demonstrate with facts or explain to me that Harry Potter was there .
CRONIN car is not TDC 1987 car and here my email olczyk@yahoo.com
If you want to fight with me for this fact, take a laywer, provide photos of Cronin car, we will go to Matter ( IF HE STILL HAVE THE ORIGINAL SHELL WHICH I DOUBT TODAY ) and the world will see that Cronin lie to you .
It s simple to clear the sky if your intentions are honest.
I m waiting Cronin photos, documentation and I will prove 100 % that I m right.
But Cronin will never contact me, because he known the truth.
You want to defend Cronin ?, contact him and tell him to contact me with photos. I m open to discussion, but I did contact him 3 years ago and he never provide any photos to me for the Prodrive book that I ve made , WHY ?

All the papers are at your disposition if you send me email.
We have invoice from Prodrive, import papers from Lebanon, papers 316 BMW from 1985 for GXI9427, etc.
Now, I m waiting photos of Cronin car for 3 years....
 
#200 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Hello everybody,
Why it s so difficult to see the papers or Matter plate for Cronin car ?
As everybody known Cronin car have been damage badly a fews times, may be he have been reshell, I don t known but would like to see some good photos of it.
The plate GXI 9427 is a BMW 316 from 1985 and when you have a BMW M3 built in 1988, I don t think that you can do that.

I m sure that most of you are intelligent but nobody answer the question of how it s possible that a car built in 1988 was rallied in 1987. Now you can continue to
claim funny things but intelligent people demonstrate with facts or explain to me that Harry Potter was there .
CRONIN car is not TDC 1987 car and here my email olczyk@yahoo.com
If you want to fight with me for this fact, take a laywer, provide photos of Cronin car, we will go to Matter ( IF HE STILL HAVE THE ORIGINAL SHELL WHICH I DOUBT TODAY ) and the world will see that Cronin lie to you .
It s simple to clear the sky if your intentions are honest.
I m waiting Cronin photos, documentation and I will prove 100 % that I m right.
But Cronin will never contact me, because he known the truth.
You want to defend Cronin ?, contact him and tell him to contact me with photos. I m open to discussion, but I did contact him 3 years ago and he never provide any photos to me for the Prodrive book that I ve made , WHY ?

All the papers are at your disposition if you send me email.
We have invoice from Prodrive, import papers from Lebanon, papers 316 BMW from 1985 for GXI9427, etc.
Now, I m waiting photos of Cronin car for 3 years....
You my French friend are nothing but a con artist,who has juat realised that you bought a total scrapheap of a rally car and you are now trying to offload it to another unsuspecting customer
What you should be doing is swallowing your pride and getting on with the fact that you have a total dud.One thing you should not be doing is trying to discredit another mans property.What you are doing is totally illegal and sooner or later you will be found out.
You are totally dillusional,you can go on about log books and other things but the fact of the matter is you do not hold the log book for that car.
Do me a favour and spend the day on google and there you will find your answers,photos,forums all you need is there.Please do not go ringing prodrive and save yourself the embarrasment.

Now please go back under whatever rock you came out of and do everybody a massive favour..

Au-revoir you clown..
 
#175 · (Edited)
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

It's this simple, you claim the GXI was sold to the Lebanon in early 1988 while in Rothmans Colours. How is this possible, firstly GXI was not in ROthmans colours in 1988 as it had been repainted in late 1987 into Bastos colours, you can check this with Prodrive employees at the time they will confirm. During 1988 while you say the car was in the Lebanon, Prodrive were running the car for Patrick Snijers in the European championship Why would they run a car they had apparently sold, do remember they would have had to produce the log book for scrutiny, but how could they have the log book you say it was in the Lebanon. At the end of 1988 the car was sold to Bertie Fisher, again if you check with the Prodrive employees at the time they will also confirm this as they jointly looked after the car with Sydney Meeke Motorsport a full pictorial history of the car is available since then. I was also asked was it possible if a car was Re shelled by Prodrive that the old car kept it's identity and the answer was NO. I also asked would they take the cage out of the old shell and put it into the new shell, and replace it with a Reece shell again the answer
was no. At the end of the day, you do not have the log book for GXI and you can claim and counter claim, no one has to show you any documents as no one has to prove anything to you. You are selling a car for 50k which is worth many times that price, if as you say it is real why have BMW Not bought it for there museum in Munich and why have Prodrive not bought it after all they
are selling two, yes two customer spec M3's for between 120k and 140kand one is a rebuilt Reece car.

Ps Cronin is not misleading anyone, what you are claiming is Prodrive committed fraud by selling the same car twice. Take that up with the Police.
 
#178 · (Edited)
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

YOU STILL NOT GET IT, GXI 9427 is BMW 316 from 1985, THE REG Number was transfering on 2 or 3 differents cars. Believe what you want, and say Hello to Elvis
The king is dead baby....had nobody told you???...or is he still alive in never never land where you live with peter pan and your genuine "works car"......fu**ing hot rod heap of scrap!!
 
#180 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

I like the great education and the polite posts of this forum, this show of well some of you are educated. Never mind, all Irish people are not like this...I hope as I see some clever post from people who don t believe in Santa Claus. And please respect PRODRIVE and their invoice
 
#182 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

You are nothing but a con artist. Well a wanna-be anyway ha. All you can do is come on the internet and talk shit about elvis and santa and stuff? Places for you my friend and there's a place for the original works bmw aswell. . Inside denis cronins shed where it is and will remain to stay.
 
#183 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

You are nothing but a con artist. Well a wanna-be anyway ha. All you can do is come on the internet and talk pineapple about elvis and santa and stuff? Places for you my friend and there's a place for the original works bmw aswell. . Inside denis cronins shed where it is and will remain to stay.
Thanks for Prodrive, did the invoice was real or it s vision ?
You are very polite, of course, it s more easy to insult when you hyde behind a pseudo like a little girl
 
#184 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Did people ever think this fella bought the car and could have paid big money for it and is now trying to sell it onto to some else and get his money back and the real car is still in West Cork.By keep arguing with Olczyk we will make that REPLICA famous like Mador in Lighting McQueen
 
#186 · (Edited)
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

What confuses me is that this lad keeps showing this prodrive invoice and saying look I have an invoice it proves I have the car! All this proves is that someone bought a car of them in 88. Is it an m3? Probably looking at the price they paid for it. Is it the one that won Corsica? Well I dunno because it doesn't say what it was. Yer man seems to think that since he has the invoice from the sale in 88 that he has the legondary gxi but I don't think he realises that more than 1 prodrive group a m3 would have been would in 88!

I would ask you to answer the questions asked here. No beating round the bush with the same replies every time. Explain to us the dodgy look of it. The **** poor preparation inside the car and the fact that the roll cage is inconsistent with the car used in the 87 Corsica rally and other prodrive m3's

Just one last thought. Rally cars have a tough life. Wear and tare plus the odd crash means that very few original parts from a car as old as cronins remain on the car. So to me however owned the tax book owns the car and that person is Denis cronin.
 
#196 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

You lot are worse for even arguing with him and giving him the time of day, oh and Olczyc I've just been told Cronin says he wants you to come over and photograph his car for him...book a flight to Cork and let us know what time your arriving, I'm sure there be a few people there to meet you...
 
#198 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

You lot are worse for even arguing with him and giving him the time of day, oh and Olczyc I've just been told Cronin says he wants you to come over and photograph his car for him...book a flight to Cork and let us know what time your arriving, I'm sure there be a few people there to meet you...
To take a photo of a reshell car have no interest for me, but thank you for the invitation. As a reshell car, he don t have anymore the Matter plate, then, it s rebody car, no interest for me. Thank You
 
#202 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

ok so is everybody missing the obvious here, mr. harry potter fans' skip has the prodrive chassis no. p88/025 now does this not mean his car was built in 88, car number 25??
as for the car being taxed as a 316, m3's wernt available as a proper uk model, hense the need to type approve, it was an easier process in n. ireland hense the ni plates on many of them. right up until recently it was common practice to register rallycars as the basic model road version, even a few works focus were registered as galaxy's if i remember correctly
 
#203 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

ok so is everybody missing the obvious here, mr. harry potter fans' skip has the prodrive chassis no. p88/025 now does this not mean his car was built in 88, car number 25??
as for the car being taxed as a 316, m3's wernt available as a proper uk model, hense the need to type approve, it was an easier process in n. ireland hense the ni plates on many of them. right up until recently it was common practice to register rallycars as the basic model road version, even a few works focus were registered as galaxy's if i remember correctly
The P88 in the P88/025 does not mean it was an chassis made in 1988 that is for sure.Why Prodrive chose them numbers i dont know ....
 
#204 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Just another thing on the roll cage when a few people inspected that BMW three series over at Coys last week it was some kind of bolt in job , a proper Prodrive M3 has the cage behind the seats coming down on top of the suspension turrets and than weather its coming down on to the floor or through the floor but it actually holds up the rear diff cradle underneath the car . Now i hope i explained that in a way that everybody might understand bearing in mind that i never saw a proper Prodrive M3 and if anybody can explain it better please do ;) but that Three series BMW over in Coys did not have that last week ....
 
#206 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Just another thing on the roll cage when a few people inspected that BMW three series over at Coys last week it was some kind of bolt in job , a proper Prodrive M3 has the cage behind the seats coming down on top of the suspension turrets and than weather its coming down on to the floor or through the floor but it actually holds up the rear diff cradle underneath the car . Now i hope i explained that in a way that everybody might understand bearing in mind that i never saw a proper Prodrive M3 and if anybody can explain it better please do ;) but that Three series BMW over in Coys did not have that last week ....
The cage in the car shown at Coys stand is exactly the same as the cage in the Russian brothers Reece car recently found in Russia and converted into a full group A car by Prodrive, it had bolt in cage. The Coys shell is a proper group A shell, but a with a Reece car cage and it never had the full group A Cage in it.
 
#207 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Sorry to come into this conversation late (and I'm not trying to name call), but Olczyk Philippe: are you the same Olczyk Philippe who ripped off the RS200.org site and created a completely fake website purely for the purpose of selling another "genuine" car?

If you are I wouldn't believe a single word in any of your posts: or that the car is anything but a heap you are trying to palm off on someone as a genuine rally car.
 
#208 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Sorry to come into this conversation late (and I'm not trying to name call), but Olczyk Philippe: are you the same Olczyk Philippe who ripped off the RS200.org site and created a completely fake website purely for the purpose of selling another "genuine" car?

If you are I wouldn't believe a single word in any of your posts: or that the car is anything but a heap you are trying to palm off on someone as a genuine rally car.
The Plot thickens!!!
 
#211 ·
#212 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Just to fill you in on the whole RS200 debacle, the RS200 registry used to be viewable on the domain http://www.rs200.org up until a few years ago. This site contained all the known information (as compiled by a chap called Justin Smith) on each chassis number RS200, its current owner and location.

An argument erupted between the seller of a specific RS200 (who was later revealed as Olczyk Philippe) and those who had compiled the information on RS200.org with regards to the history of the aforementioned car. Olczyk Philippe disagreed with what the RS200.org site stated, but evidence all pointed to the facts on there being correct.

This resulted in Olczyk Philippe copying all the data from RS200.org (pictures, text, page layout... everything) and setting up an identical site at RS200.com: except all references to Justin Smith were replaced with Olczyk Philippe and all reference to RS200.org were replaced with RS200.com. And of course the questioned data on the RS200 for sale was tweaked on Olczyk Philippe's version of the site according to his "history" of the car.

Olczyk Philippe later published a book (the bulk of which comprised of data stolen from the RS200.org site) and he continues to run RS200.com and an RS200 fan page on Facebook. You'll note that the sections of RS200.com put together by Olczyk Philippe himself are written with the same grasp of English as the the poster on here. As Cian Corbett points out as well, if you Google his name it crops up on a number of forums next to a number of questionable "barn find" and "rare" racing cars. All seems a mighty coincidence to me...

As a consequence of the data theft and site duplication, RS200.org underwent a major facelift and is now a secure forum rather than the "open" site it was before.
 
#269 · (Edited by Moderator)
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Just to fill you in on the whole RS200 debacle, the RS200 registry used to be viewable on the domain http://www.rs200.org up until a few years ago. This site contained all the known information (as compiled by a chap called Justin Smith) on each chassis number RS200, its current owner and location.

An argument erupted between the seller of a specific RS200 (who was later revealed as Olczyk Philippe) and those who had compiled the information on RS200.org with regards to the history of the aforementioned car. Olczyk Philippe disagreed with what the RS200.org site stated, but evidence all pointed to the facts on there being correct.

This resulted in Olczyk Philippe copying all the data from RS200.org (pictures, text, page layout... everything) and setting up an identical site at RS200.com: except all references to Justin Smith were replaced with Olczyk Philippe and all reference to RS200.org were replaced with RS200.com. And of course the questioned data on the RS200 for sale was tweaked on Olczyk Philippe's version of the site according to his "history" of the car.

Olczyk Philippe later published a book (the bulk of which comprised of data stolen from the RS200.org site) and he continues to run RS200.com and an RS200 fan page on Facebook. You'll note that the sections of RS200.com put together by Olczyk Philippe himself are written with the same grasp of English as the the poster on here. As Cian Corbett points out as well, if you Google his name it crops up on a number of forums next to a number of questionable "barn find" and "rare" racing cars. All seems a mighty coincidence to me...

As a consequence of the data theft and site duplication, RS200.org underwent a major facelift and is now a secure forum rather than the "open" site it was before.
More funny, you don t have my official Book ( with all M- Sport Database for WRC ) but if you did, you will not make theses comments.
Justin try to manipulate the history of many cars include chassis 161 built by Ford as a RHD street car, but Justin claim everywhere that the car is a Evo LHD http://rs200.com/newsletter/1989_03 rs200 newsletter.pdf
Of course, the fact that the owner of 161 is a friend of him is not important.
Ford News Letter State that the car is a RDH Street car. If I was not there top correct the truth, Justin claim that the car is a EVO LHD and the world will believe him. At the end I wrote the official book with the help of M-Sport when Justin still claim funny stories to please his friends , I working now on the Subaru book ( from the archives of Prodrive ) and so on.

Gentlemen, you tease me a lot, but I have a serious person's appointment, I must leave you. Have a nice day

Cronin is lucky, you are stupid its position as the day came, he said, C is not me, c who said
 
#213 · (Edited)
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

Philippe – its great to see you on here. I am intrigued by your references to Elvis, Santa and Harry Potter – it might just shed some light on the world you inhabit. Furthermore it lends some credence to those who believe that your literary endeavours should be stocked on the fiction shelves rather than with the motoring or reference books.
Let’s not kid ourselves here Philippe – what you are selling is an invoice from Prodrive. You have tacked on a car to add value. At best the car may have history, at worst it’s a handful of parts on wheels. We used to live in a fantasy world here too Philippe – it was called the Celtic Tiger. We had cheap French and German money and we had more World Rally Cars per head of population than anywhere else in the world. So we know what ex works car cost. At €24,000 it is somewhere between one and two zeros shy of the true value. I suspect you were hoping that the current owner of the real car would give you easy money just to go away.
Philippe – coming on this forum was not a great idea. It reminds me of my cat who catches a mouse after his meal – he’s not hungry but will play with it anyway. Most of the contributors on here , myself included, haven’t €24 to spend on your car not to mind €24,000 – they do have time on their hands and you are a handy diversion and possibly an outlet for their frustrations.
You picked the wrong country and the wrong car. Us Irish will con one another and take pleasure in it but we close ranks and will defend one another from outsiders.
The car is far too well known in this country – I would even go so far as to say that it is more cherished for its history in this country than its links with the World Championship.
If you can persuade Sarkosy and Merkyl to let us have more cheap money we will buy your car. Otherwise it might be better to sell on the “spares on wheels” for what it is and put the “Invoice” up on ebay. Just make sure that you get Dave Richards to autograph it as that will add value – I will put an opening bid of €24 on it.

PS - Anyone got a lend of €24 ?
 
#217 ·
Re: [UNTRUE]Cronin M3 going up for auction???

I dont know Denis or anyone important in this..

But could someone pass on NOT to post any paper work online. By the sounds of this he will just copy them and then pass it off that he found the logbook.
was thinking the same thing, he seems pretty persistent to get Dennis to put the pictures up. The less information anyone puts up here about the Real Car that Dennis has the better
 
#216 ·
Re: fake M3 going up for auction???

as someone just reading all posts it would seem he is trying to wind people up, so that some one may put up some paperwork or pics of paperwork so that he can then copy it. i saw the car at coys and does not look like the real thing to me, it looks like a bad rally car build with a lot of road car trim in it.
however i would like him to pick the lottery numbers for me as he does seem to be able to find these rare cars ??? or so he would like to think ???
 
#219 · (Edited by Moderator)
Re: fake M3 going up for auction???

Did anyone call the police when the car was in the UK. Surely they would be interested in a car being sold on false plates
Funny you should mention that, I spoke to one of Scotland Yards finest today, explained the situation and the upshot is if the car is in the UK they will lift it, the owner then has the opportunity to produce the tax book within 21 days, failure to do so means the car gets crushed. So if anyone knows where it is, let me know and I will get it lifted and crushed.
 
#220 ·
Re: fake M3 going up for auction???

this guy is also on the s14.net forum where he claims he owns EDZ 4346. on 1 of his posts he says he has the entry form from monte carlo rally and the original papers from prodrive and the registration of EDZ 4346. when another member asked if it was the real EDZ or a replica our friend got very defensive.
 
#221 ·
Re: fake M3 going up for auction???

this guy is also on the s14.net forum where he claims he owns EDZ 4346. on 1 of his posts he says he has the entry form from monte carlo rally and the original papers from prodrive and the registration of EDZ 4346. when another member asked if it was the real EDZ or a replica our friend got very defensive.
He probably has the genuine letter that Santa wrote back to him.

You have to give him this - he sure did brighten up a boring month of January.
 
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